People Archives - Page 2 of 2 - Maestro Filmworks - Philadelphia Video Production Company & Creative Agency

Project Forte: Ryan Sun

May 7, 2021

by Patrick Community DOCUMENTARY People Project Forte Social Social Responsibility Uncategorized

Ryan Sun (he/him) is a post-producer for AlkemyX in Philadelphia and has a rounded portfolio, breaching almost every skill in the industry. This week through Project Forte, we delve into Ryan’s outlook on specialization in the workforce and why he finds it important to mentor and bring up others around him. Read about how Ryan found self awareness and new goals which will celebrate and preserve his family’s diverse cultural background.

Written and Edited by Kate Feher

__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Ryan Sun: My name is Ryan Sun and I am a post-producer for Alkemy X. I am of Filipino-Chinese descent, originally from South Jersey, and I’ve been living in the city and suburbs of Philadelphia for about 17 years now.

Kris Mendoza: How did you get your start in the industry? It sounds like you went to school locally?

Ryan Sun: Yeah, I went to Temple University and graduated with a BA in Film and Media Arts. Their program was highly ranked and very helpful in terms of leading students into this industry and preparing me for my career.

Kris Mendoza: In what way?

Ryan Sun: I was able to get an internship working in local news and that led to a position as a technical operations coordinator for the NBC news affiliate here in Philly. At the time I was toggling between production and post, doing local independent projects, commercial work, and eventually settling in on assistant editing / editor work. I even got to do some background work down in Virginia for a movie called Evan Almighty and that led to PA-work on other bigger budget movies. So, I’ve run the gamut as far as different types of work goes and settling in. I was really big on being a jack of all trades / master of none with my eyes set on editing.

Kris Mendoza: How did you get yourself to editing after all that?

Ryan Sun: Yeah, in 2012 I picked up an assistant editing position with Alkemy X – at the time they were known as Shooters – and I was there for their heavy political season in 2012. That led to a staff position as a junior editor for about 4 years before I went to Bowstring Studios up in Conshohocken to do some other fun engaging projects with them in 2018.

Bowstring let me go when the pandemic hit, which happened to a lot of people. It actually allowed me to start freelancing which, ironically, gave me an even surer foot in the market and the industry.

Kris Mendoza: It’s great that you stayed so positive through that experience.

Ryan Sun: Yeah, this past year I really got a chance to explore a lot of my creative sides as far as editing, freelancing, and learning how people were handling projects and jobs as we moved through this whole lockdown and quarantine situation. Over this time, I also got to reconnect with the SVP of Operations from Alkemy X, and picked up a post producing position, so here we are today!

Kris Mendoza: You touched on two things there… First, what’s the importance of specializing? You talk about being a jack of all trades but also about honing in on a particular craft. I think oftentimes, myself included, you might graduate and want to do absolutely everything, for whoever’s going to hire you, you know? You’re eager and you just sign up with anyone who wants to give you money. Maybe then, you very quickly realize you need to be known for something that you do very well, whether it’s gaffer, grip, editor… anything like that leads to more opportunities. Is specialization better in terms of self-branding or professional branding for yourself? What are your thoughts on that?

Ryan Sun: I think that it can be a double-edged sword in a way because when you hone yourself, you’re really committing and defining yourself and you have to be ready for that. I’m a little indecisive though I wouldn’t say non-committal. I feel, personally, that I have a lot to offer and a lot of facets to myself which should be honored. I’m open and I don’t want to shut out opportunities that come my way.

The other edge of that sword involves getting pigeon-holed. I know so many people that want to be… I don’t know. They want to be a writer. Well… they’re also really good at being an AD. It’s hard to branch out toward your writing goal if you’re being hired to second or AD your whole life.

For the longest time, I was playing to one strength that I had of understanding workflow and how to get from point A to point B on a project. So, I became known as this assistant guy who could get projects started and progressing with a plan. It was really hard to break out of that position and into an actual editor role where I get to make creative decisions and help people understand my ideas for a narrative or commercial or whatever it is. So, like I said, it’s a double-edged sword for people like me. Other opportunities that I took to remain active and relevant kept pulling me back to one thing or another. Regardless, my experience with exercising multiple skills all comes together to better inform my current position in a really engaging way.

Kris Mendoza: What level of balance between internal and external validation occurs while you’re narrowing in a career? For example, and I’ll speak from experience, there was a point in my life when I was doing a bunch of work shooting and editing. I called myself a videographer. I never quite felt comfortable calling myself a DP nor did I feel comfortable calling myself an editor. I was just not very good or confident about either skill. That’s the internal. The external is when people might tell you, you are that DP or you are that editor, until the internal catches up, and you can define yourself.

Ryan Sun: Yeah. When I started freelancing, people recognized that I had a lot to offer in different roles. I was getting various jobs based on what they remembered of a specialized aspect of my skills set.

When they recognized I could do more, that helped me see more opportunities. It pushed me to think, “Oh, you know what? Maybe, I can direct this thing, or maybe I can lend my hand towards a little graphic animation, create assets, or in another aspect of this job over here…”

It’s about self-awareness. It’s going to be a little bit different for everyone, and this is how it found me and how I found it.

I think you should do what makes you most afraid, what scares you to the point of finding your own edges.

Grip2 — Ryan Sun photographed by Christina Rose

Kris Mendoza: Absolutely. So, circling back, you gave us a pretty good understanding of winding down an unconventional career path. I want to unpack that, was it unconventional from the typical corporate 9-5 or unconventional from a cultural standpoint?

Ryan Sun: Oh, from a cultural standpoint is what I meant by that, yeah. My parents are off the boat Filipino, but they were never super conservative or strict like, “You should go be a doctor. You should be a nurse. You should be something where you have that nine-to-five job or this is what the job is kind of person.” I think they knew, and I knew, from the get-go that I wasn’t going to be very conventional.

But you’re asked as a kid what you want to become, and I wanted to be a magician chef. My parents said, “You don’t want to be a chef.” [They didn’t even acknowledge the magician part of it] They said “You’ll work terrible hours. You won’t have any friends. You won’t make a lot of money. It’s going to be hot…” I remember, some part of that sounded engaging. It sounded fun and exciting. But regardless, it was at the forefront of their minds that I should find a way to grow my roots, whatever it was. With film, they didn’t really know what to make of it, and they didn’t mind for the most part, but they were always worried about me finding success.

For them, it’s the monetary aspect of being able to survive making a living off of whatever video editing means or whatever getting into media communications means. The idea of a starving artist is prevalent, especially in Asian culture. They avoid it by being very strict on school, bringing honor to the family, being very diligent and hardworking.

Screen Shot 2021 05 06 At 4.08.15 PM — It is now abundantly clear where Ryan Sun gets all of his energy to keep working…

What’s different generationally is not just the idea of success but the concept of hard work too. My parents came to this country in order to provide a better life for their kids. If you think about it, they gave up a lot of themselves to come to a foreign country, start fresh, and make a brand new kind of life for their family. That was hard work.

Kris Mendoza: So, you talk about defining success as being so subjective. How do you define success? You’ve made this a career, so it’s possible to have that success in film & TV and not own a starving artist label.

Ryan Sun: Yeah. Absolutely. I think that as far as success goes, I’ve been very fortunate to have met certain people and been able to have a support group like that. Coming out of college, a lot of people reached out to me or kept me in mind when it came to different projects. My talents and skill sets took me far, but I think without those connections, I recognize my goals might not have come to fruition.

I’m not even saying that I’m successful, I think I’m still figuring it out. People think about success monetarily: how much are they making, how much money they have, how much is their time worth. For me, I think that there’s a holistic aspect to success and how you feel as a person, and what you can contribute to the world with your gifts. I try to pay it forward and use a lot of my experiences to give back to students that are just coming out of college or people that are able to get a start into this industry. I find that very rewarding, personally and so that embodies a sense of success in itself. I can use my place to connect them to the right people.

Screen Shot 2021 05 06 At 4.08.01 PM — Behind the scenes with Ryan Sun

The constant search for work as a freelancer is probably one of the most daunting things you can endure. It’s a mark of success in itself when people remember me and reach out for more work, otherwise I would spend 100% of my time doing that instead. Now it’s 50/50 hunting and gathering. Not to mention, being told, “Hey, I can really use your help on this.” is so rewarding. That’s how I gauge success.

Kris Mendoza: Do you think that whole notion of giving back and ushering in the next generation was fostered in you by someone in particular? How did you arrive at that mission?

Ryan Sun: So, actually to answer your question there, it’s because no one offered that to me. I feel like growing up, school, being on projects.. there’s a lot of stuff that I had to figure out on my own and said, “God, I wish someone would have told me this.” And just taking the time to encourage someone to go to a happy hour with industry folks can make a big difference too. There’s a lot to be learned in that aspect and it’s hard doing it without a lot of guidance.

Kris Mendoza: In terms of breaking into this industry… Almost every success story involves someone helping you up a ladder, but it can also be a kind of Catch-22. I mean, there’s still nepotism, favoritism, and cronyism. Unqualified people get jobs in every industry because they are given an opportunity from someone who feels connected to or responsible for helping a familiar struggle. That’s how the status quo gets fed. With Asian-Americans existing as a minority, it can be that much harder to break into a very distinct establishment, any thoughts on that? Did any of that factor into your early filmmaking days or even in film school?

Ryan Sun: Well, yes and no. I might have to go back to my upbringing to explain this. I grew up in a small town in South Jersey called Pennsville. Their claim to fame was being the town next to the town where Bruce Willis grew up. The demographic was primarily White and Christian.

My parents ended up here because my uncle worked as a doctor at the county hospital. He sponsored my dad to come lay down roots there, in the center of the tri-state area. I was one of maybe a handful of Asians in this town. There was still a strong Filipino community because they stuck together, maybe to survive. I remember going to backyard parties, having pig roasts, and doing all sorts of fun Filipino activities. But for the most part, going to school, I was surrounded by white people all the time. I hate to say it, but I became whitewashed in a way.

I was in some dumb band with my best friends growing up, and we had a little geocities website. But we wrote as our description that we were just “three dumb white kids from South Jersey.” And then, we looked at that sentence and all of us said, “Wait a second. Something isn’t right here.” I stopped, and I realized, “Holy shit. I’m not white.”

I didn’t see myself as different from these kids of Anglo-Saxon Christian Catholic backgrounds, and that’s not to say my parents didn’t try to instill our own culture in me. I didn’t want to be different, and I mentally blocked a bit of my Asian identity and made their white-ness a part of my life. You get teased in school, especially in a town like that, very conservative minds and very right-wing focus. And so, I saw that kind of target mentality towards anyone who was different. There were probably two or three black kids in my school, I was one of three Asians, and some of us got bullied. But I felt like I wasn’t on the other side because I had been around these people all my life. I couldn’t see that I wasn’t one of them.

So, using that growing up experience and going back to the original question: getting my start in this industry, I didn’t fully expect to be treated any differently concerning my race or cultural identity. I will say though that I remember going to my first internship, with all different walks of life sitting in the room with me as we went in for our first intern meeting…

I looked around and didn’t see anyone that looked like me. I don’t think it was a hindrance. If anything, it made me stand out. I’m not trying to say that me being different gave me an edge. I’m just saying that I think that it’s one of those things that people just notice. I’ve actually been mistaken for a few other Asians in this market…

Kris Mendoza: Who I’m sure you look nothing like, right?

Ryan Sun: Yeah. It was Neal Santos, who I went to school with.

Kris Mendoza: I know Neal. [jokes] Ok, maybe you look a little alike…

Ryan Sun: I could see maybe distant cousins, right? But one guy mistook me for him, and I’ve been mistaken for Ben Wong also, he’s an audio engineer.

Kris Mendoza: I know Ben, that one’s a little harder of a sell for sure. It’s not racist or hateful, but it is somewhat rooted in ignorance or just mistake people of color for someone else who looks nothing like them.

Ryan Sun: They’ll see someone that resembles me and it’s a harmless kind of thought, but at the same time it strikes this chord, “Where’s that coming from? What does that mean deep down?” I do try not to read into it too much.

Kris Mendoza: I mean I think it takes a good level of self-security to brush past that. It could eat away at a person…

Ryan Sun: Oh, absolutely. Yeah.

Kris Mendoza: I can’t really navigate through this without touching on – call it – the current state of being Asian. This is an interesting time especially after a year like 2020 with focus landing on social injustices against people of color, specifically the Black and Asian communities. What role can we play in helping to stop this within our industry?

Ryan Sun: I’m glad you asked, and I should say that I am so totally not a political person, but if anything these past four years have forced me to be hyper-aware. I was involved in the political cycle, working on ads this past election, and I learned that I don’t know as much as I should. You go toe-to-toe with people that are super into what’s happening and I want to hold my own in those conversations – uncomfortable conversations even – but I’m not confrontational and I don’t want to say anything too damning.

We have seen a lot of injustices and outward transgressions towards people of color and the Asian community. I’ll be blunt about this, growing up as I described, I certainly witnessed a lot of that mentality. I’ve never had anything outwardly scary happen to me while living there but the micro-aggressions are noticeable. My wife is Jewish, and we’re an interracial couple, so I’m hyper aware of that.

And I hate to say it, but in 2016 when we elected Trump as president, I saw a lot of that vitriol and hate in my social media feed. There was a new public mentality that it was ok to outwardly display this kind of behavior now. More recently, I saw a video of this woman in New York who got beaten up on her way to church. I thought, “Holy Cow, this is scary”

Kris Mendoza: You think: “This could be your mom, my mom, or your lola.”

Ryan Sun: Oh my god, yes, she was a 60-year-old Filipino woman on her way to church. Take race out of it for a second… for anyone to just wail on an elderly woman is so obscene. Then, you add the fact she was targeted for being Asian, and this man thought she didn’t belong here. I mean that just sets off a lot of bells.

It raises an issue in our society of how Asian culture is viewed. If anything, we’re seen as the comedic sidekick, the comic relief, or just the fun-loving Asian guy: the Jackie Chan. We’re not necessarily seen as threatening or –

Kris Mendoza: – or controversial or anything like that –

Ryan Sun: I personally am a fun-loving guy but I’m not sure anyone should equate that to me being Asian or not. I wish we weren’t portrayed as goofy. And that’s changed a lot over the years, but holding on to pure culture and respect for traditions is important because there still is a lot of whitewashing. Well, who was it, Scarlett Johansson? She was going to play some anime character. Think about that loss for Asian culture.

I’m a big fan of cooking shows, as an aspiring magician chef, and Anthony Bourdain did a phenomenal job of highlighting the Filipino culture in his show No Reservations. Honestly, watching that episode made me cry. I was very emotional just because it was so endearing to see someone respect the culture and understand where people of my country came from and what they hold true in themselves.

Kris Mendoza: Is it fair to say that as media makers and storytellers, especially being people of color and Asian, it’s our responsibility to tell our own stories accurately? It’s going to be a slow burn… a feature film or two won’t suddenly change the perception of Asians. You talk about this “goofiness” and that comes from years and years of conditioning in Hollywood, creating those stereotypes.

Ryan Sun: I think honestly, for any culture, it’s important to maintain the rights to our stories, whether you are Black, Asian, First Nation, Indian, Caucasian…

I told you about growing up whitewashed, well now I’m now playing catch up in regards to understanding my own culture, who I am, who my family is, and where I see myself going. I’m having a kid this summer. I need to make sure that this child is going to be raised knowing that we have a very vibrant Filipino culture on one side and on the other there will be Hebrew school and learning about Judaism. I think it is our responsibility, yes, and we’re the ones with the tools so if we don’t tell our stories, who will?

Kris Mendoza: No better way to end it right there. Any parting thoughts?

Ryan Sun: I think that for me and for any other marginalized person in this industry, it’s always important to stay true to yourself. Do what you need to do to stay on a path that fulfills you, but also stay true to your culture and family.

Project Forte: Hillary Hanak

April 30, 2021

by Patrick Community People Project Forte Social Social Media Social Responsibility

Hillary Hanak (she/her) is a seasoned cinematographer from West Chester, PA, who cut her teeth in the competitive Los Angeles scene before settling back into the Philadelphia area. With over 20 years in film, and the foresight to learn at every opportunity, she’s wise to the nature of the industry and how to navigate it. Hillary has fostered opportunities for many promising young talents, recognizing the benefits of building a strong community of filmmakers in our city. She leads by example, fulfilling a crucial responsibility to usher in much needed change. Project Forte strives to create the dialogue for experiences and perspectives so we can establish the need for that change.

Written and Edited by Kate Feher

_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Hillary Hanak: I am Hillary Hanak-Newman…the Newman part is really only Facebook official, I just got married this past year. I’m a freelance Director of Photography and I’m the Video Content Producer and Director of Photography at Aramark.

Kris Mendoza: How did you get started in the industry?

Hillary Hanak: I went to college for Film & Video at University of Pittsburgh, which was a theory-based program at the time, so they paired us with Pittsburgh Filmmakers for production and hands on courses. After I graduated, I moved out to California with not much money in my pocket. I had emailed over 200 DPs before I left, just going down the list of DPs in Los Angeles, and one of them responded to me and said, “Yeah, I’ve got a feature coming up. You can be the loader, no problem.” And that was my first job, loading film canisters for features, before the writers strike happened.

During that time, a lot of work washed up, but I had a 9-5 at a film lab, called Fotokem, on the weekends, and I could still freelance during the week. I worked for a place called Wooden Nickel, which is a grip and lighting rental house out there. It turned out to be a great way to network and I got to know everyone in the business while I worked there. Then I started my own grip and lighting rental company called Get a Grip Equipment in Los Angeles. I bought a truck, I bought gear and… I had a partner at the time and we just took every job we could take to build our name and build our reputation, and that ended up working out really well. We were really successful. We worked on everything, from low budget and no budget, all the way up to working with the Foo Fighters on “Sound City, and “Sonic Highways”. And really got into the rock documentary niche by the end of my time in LA.

I was with someone for 13 years and they ended up passing away out in Los Angeles, and it was really difficult. So, I came back here to be closer to family and still wanted to be in the film business, but didn’t know how that was going to work out. And soon as I moved back here, I got a call from the Foo Fighters, again, to do a second documentary with them. I ended up driving across the country and then flying back and going on the road with them for about a year.

Screen Shot 2021 04 29 At 11.23.02 PM — Hillary and Matt on the Foo Fighters Truck

Kris Mendoza: Coincidentally, it seems like we both moved out to LA right around the same time. I got there and the writer strike happened, but I did not give it as much of a chance as you did. I did a year out there, I don’t want to say it was wasted, but I didn’t get to work on anything substantial. I didn’t know that you had your own rental business at one point out there . That’s pretty awesome.

Hillary Hanak: We had it for about five years, from 2008 to 2013. When I left, my business partner, Igor Kamoevi, and I just literally split the company in half. So, I have half the gear here and he has half the gear there. He took the truck and I took the van and we kind of split it up that way. He still has our clients out there. And then when our clients need somebody on the east coast, they call me. So, we’re still in contact, and he’s still working under that name, but I ended up coming here.

Kris Mendoza: In terms of the kind of work you do now… I know you have a 9 to 5 producing videos at Aramark but what kind of work do you keep busy with on the freelance cinematographer side of things?

Hillary Car Rig Block — Hillary Hanak on the set of Block

Hillary Hanak: Before the pandemic I did a short film for Carrie Brennan called Block, which is running the festival circuit right now, and doing really well. It’s won a couple of awards for directing and performance. I’m also currently in post-production on a documentary that Kelly Murray and I produced. It’s called The Openers and it follows an aspiring Philly comedian as he breaks into the comedy scene and opens for other stand-up comics. The goal is to capture the journey comedians take in the very beginning of their careers, before they establish themselves in the scene, or work their way up to a Netflix special.

313 Bts Kelly And Hillary — Hillary Hanak and Kelly Murray behind the scenes on the set of 3:13

I am working on a documentary about the four men surrounding Malcolm X and then another documentary about Alexander McClay Williams who was a 16 year old African-American boy in the 1930s who was convicted and put to death for a murder that he didn’t commit. I have a lot of things in the works and passions I’m working on constantly.

We went up to New York a couple years ago and shot Alicia Keys, and we did the Jonas Brothers documentary, travelling down to Cuba with them. It just keeps coming and coming and going. And I just balance it out with other work. I never say no. I just say yes, and I figure it out later.

Kris Mendoza: That’s the way to go. It’s the blessing and the curse of being busy and when it rains, it pours. Just saying yes and figuring it out later is sometimes the best way to go.

You seem to have a gravitational pull towards documentary. Is that by nature, kind of working on with the Foo Fighters and becoming known for an aesthetic?

Hillary Hanak: I did just fall into the rock documentary genre, to be honest with you, but I’ve always had an affinity for real life, true stories and documentaries.

I was working on this low budget film with a DP who was, like, eight and a half months pregnant… And it was not a good movie [jokes]. And I promised her that I wasn’t going to jump off to go on another job for another three weeks; that I would finish this movie with her. And she really appreciated that. I lost a lot of money by not taking other jobs, but it was important to be there for her and support her. Sure enough, she was the one who ended up referring me to her best friend who was one of the DP’s on the Foo Fighters documentary. And I kind of fell into that and got to work with some amazing people and hear their stories. It was just fascinating to me. I thought I knew a lot about music and I thought I knew a lot about film, and I’ve come to find out that every time it’s just the surface, no matter how much you know, it feels like it’s just the surface.

Hillary Foos And Obama — Hillary Hanak pictured right, with The Foo Fighters and President Barak Obama

Kris Mendoza: Talk to me about the mission of Philadelphia Women in Film and Television (PWIFT) and what kind of work you do on the board there.

Hillary Hanak: So, I was brought on by fellow filmmaker, Dafna Yachin, who is the vice president. I did a documentary with her called The Great Flip-Off, and it was an amazing experience. We worked really well together and she recommended me to be on the board of PWIFT. When I came on, the role that was available at the time was secretary/social media director. So, I’m able to get the word out more about PWIFT. We have a real presence in Philadelphia and people know about us, but we want us to be even more of a support to the community of female filmmakers. The pandemic has been really hard. We used to have galas and events where we could do networking but now we’re making that work in the virtual world. We held an event called Focus In Zoom where we invite different female filmmakers, actors, directors, producers, crew members, and so on, to talk about their experience in the film business.. We’ve been able to do a couple of happy hours and last week one of our members held a private screening of her documentary which she wanted some feedback prior to its release. It was amazing.

Kris Mendoza: From your perspective, is there a solid community of female filmmakers supporting each other out there? What’s that like in terms of finding other women in your field, especially, to learn from and bring an open mindset?

Hillary Hanak: I can only speak from my own experience, but I feel like I have a solid group of female filmmaker friends and colleagues in Philadelphia and the surrounding areas. We push each other to do things outside of our comfort zones.

Hillary And Simone On Campbells Shoot In Philly — Hillary Hanak and Simone Holland

I remember Maestro did an interview with Bianca Moon, and in it she talked about a series, Vex, we worked on for Simone Holland. And she was getting into the grip and lighting world and was worried at the time about taking an upcoming project. And I told her, “You have it. You have the passion, you have the knowledge. You just need to believe in yourself and learn a little bit more. Don’t go on a set thinking that you know everything.” And now she is working all the time and doing great things!

Kris Mendoza: Regardless if you are a man or a woman, that should be the mindset you go in with –

Hillary Hanak: Exactly. Because the minute that you step on a set without an open mind you’re going to stop learning. I’ve been in the business for over 20 years and I’m still learning when I go on set. And I think that that’s really important. Our community is constantly expanding and we challenge each other to do better.

Kris Mendoza: We’ve interviewed for Project Forte and many of our guests have specifically mentioned you by name as someone who has helped give other women opportunities early in their careers. Supporting each other can be the simplest thing, like giving that pep talk.

Personally, I’m conscious of each time I step through a door, that someone opened that door for me, speaking figuratively. Were there people early on in your career who heralded that kind of mentorship and support, who fostered that spirit in your overall approach to things?

Grip Rig Los Angeles — Hillary Hanak behind the scenes

Hillary Hanak: Definitely. My boss, Bryan Godwin, at Wooden Nickel was very supportive of my career, and we’re still good friends today. I used to call him “my west coast dad.” He was there if I needed support or advice in LA, where there’s so much competition. I always went on set thinking, this might be my last day on this set. You never take it for granted because there’s always somebody that could take your place. You may not know everything when you step on set, but if you have a hardworking and positive attitude, if you’re kind to people, they are going to want to work with you. These are 12 hour days. You might be working for six months on a movie and you don’t want to work with a jerk every single day.

Kris Mendoza: I find myself saying that same thing. If anything, it leans towards the people-business more that the technical business. You can have someone who is great at what they do, but if you can’t work with them they’re no good.

Hillary Hanak: Yeah. And in terms of opportunities: Rachel Morrison, who is now a really famous DP – she did Mudbound – she took me under her wing. We did a film called Any Day Now in LA before she blew up. And Jessica Young is incredibly talented and always finds new and different ways to create unique vibes on screen, whether it is using strip diopters or vintage lenses or vintage lighting, she pushed me to keep thinking outside the box on different techniques possible. She was one of the Dp’s on the Foo Fighters docs, and she is still doing movies with them and those are coming out soon, and her film 2 Distant Strangers just won an Oscar! We just had a really good rapport and being able to find people you work with well, can quickly become your support system. Ultimately you want to work with people who inspire and push you toward upward mobility and the perk is that you get to not only work with these people but become friends as well.

Hillary Dafna — Hillary Hanak with Dafna Yachin

Kris Mendoza: As far as your approach to fostering strong women filmmakers in the community, you seem to be someone, just based off of what other people have said and the type of work and sets I’ve seen you on, that kind of has a very intentional approach to hiring and working with diverse sets. Why do you have that approach and what led you to have that mentality?

Hillary Hanak: It’s funny that you say that because I honestly don’t think of it that way. I just hire people that are good at their jobs and are good working together with each other. I don’t necessarily hire somebody because they’re female. For example, Fre Howard is an amazing makeup artist and I hire her for her work and her presence, not because she happens to be African-American or female. I know that any set that she goes on, everyone is going to love her and her work will be amazing.

Kris Mendoza: I 100% agree! It’s refreshing to hear you say that because it’s become the crucial point: Bianca said it, Simone said it… “I want to be hired because I’m good and people value what I’m bringing to set,” as opposed to fulfilling a check box. It’s important for folks to look a little harder and be more intentional. There’s an ecosystem you’re building through this networking amongst female filmmakers.

Bts Hillary Kelly On Your Wreckless Heart — Hillary Hanak with Kelly Murray on the set of Your Wreckless Heart

You’re putting yourself in diverse circles, and I think that’s why you end up hiring them. I don’t think it’s completely accidental, but it is great that you’re hiring them because you know that they’re good and you like working with them. There are stereotypes that say women are hard to work with… strong women, type A women… and working with women is counterproductive. What do you say to all those stereotypes? From your experience, it seems like that’s absolutely not the case because you continue to work with the same strong free-willed women that you do.

Hillary Hanak: Yeah. I’m going to be completely honest with you. There have been times where I have worked on a set of mostly women or a set with mostly men, and you can be pulling your hair out. But then on another set it can be the most amazing experience ever. It just depends on the people you are working with. The Block movie that we did had females as every department head and that was probably the best all-female shoot I’ve ever worked on. Everyone was there for each other. We were there for the film. We were there knowing our craft and working as hard as we could, and figuring out… when there were issues, we solved them and didn’t divide. So, I think with anything, you can have the good shoots and the bad shoots.

Hillary Camera Rig On Block — Hillary Hanak on the set of Block

It’s really knowing, who do you want to work with? And that’s one of the things about this industry that I love, is you get to decide who you want to work with going forward. When you’re up and coming, you might not have that luxury, but once you kind of get a name and a reputation for yourself, then you get to decide. So, if you don’t click and vibe with somebody, whether it’s male or female, you don’t have to work with them. You can find somebody else. And I think that that’s something important to understand. It’s not the end, if you don’t click with this person, there’ll be somebody else.

Kris Mendoza: What are your thoughts on women washing, it sounds so weird to say that out loud but “women washing,” in terms of crew and hiring. Does that seem counterproductive or is that something elastic we need to flex to before coming back to a new center?

Hillary Hanak: I had this happen during a job: I was crewing up and… I’ve never been asked this before… Honestly, I’ve never been asked who I’m hiring and what their ethnicity was or their race or their gender or anything. But this client said, “We want a really diverse shoot and we want a female crew.” And I said, “Well, I’ve already hired some people and they’re not what you’re looking for.” But if the client is asking you for something you have to deliver. Now, it was a little challenging to me because I had hired a guy who had done me a favor prior, and I told him, “Hey, on the next job, I’m going to get you back,” and this was a really good job.

He happened to be a white male who was fantastic at his job. He is the camera guy when I have questions. And I had to let him go because they wanted a woman of color for second camera. I didn’t have anybody in my contact list because the production wasn’t in Philadelphia and, because of COVID, a lot of people didn’t want to travel or stay in hotels. The girl I found was great but I could tell very quickly she wasn’t at the level this guy was. She still did a great job, but was newer to the film industry and he had been in the business for 15 years.

It was challenging because I wanted to give back to the person who had helped me out before and I was not able to do that. But ultimately I was able to expand my network in another city and please my client at the same time.

Kris Mendoza: Inclusivity is great, but when it becomes exclusivity, that’s when you’ve jumped on the other side of this very thin line. You’re being intentional, but it backfired. It’s good to hear you say that because we’ve been doing these interviews and don’t want it to seem like a very anti-white male initiative. That’s certainly not the case. I think there are still a finite amount of opportunities, of filmmakers, and of crew people on the supply side. It just sucks that it’s a zero-sum game.

Hillary Hanak: It negates the fact that we’re building this community to support one another, and yet we’re not able to give back when we have the chance to.

Kris Mendoza: And just to clarify, that particular job, it wasn’t like you were going into a labor and delivery room, or something very women centric that… It was not one of those situations?

Hillary Hanak: No. We had actually asked, “ Was it a sensitive subject?” But they were not able to give us a reason and… I did meet some other people on set who I had never worked with, so I got to expand my network a little bit.

Kris Mendoza: It’s an ecosystem where everyone needs to thrive and everyone needs to survive. If someone’s very good, very pleasurable to work with, they are hirable regardless of gender or color.

Hillary Hanak: And don’t get me wrong. When I first started… I was one of six females in the union that I belong to in Los Angeles out of 3000 members. Since then they’ve asked me, “Well, was it hard being… What happened when you went on set?” There were a couple of shoots where, I walked on set, and the men looked at me like, “Oh, great. We’re going to have to work harder today because we have a female.” And then I would pick up the 4/0 cable and put one on my left shoulder, and I’d pick up the 4/0 cable and put one on my right shoulder, probably 75 pounds a piece, and start walking down the road. And they would go, “Oh, okay, we’re cool. It’s all good.” And I personally loved that. I loved the look on the faces of people who underestimate me. Some younger people I’ve talked to are afraid of that moment. You should be proud of that moment. Go on set and show them you’re a bad-ass, and do what they don’t think you can handle, do your job.

Crane Hillary Movie Outside Las Vegas — Hillary Hanak pictured right

Kris Mendoza: It’s satisfying, but at the same time, that’s a privilege most people don’t have to think about: working harder to win the approval of everyone else around them. They show up on set not having to spend that first hour proving they’re worthy of being there.

Hillary Hanak: You have to arrive with the mentality “I’m here to do a job, and I’m going to do my job. And hopefully you will hire me again, but if you don’t hire me again, I’ll get another job.”

Kris Mendoza: It’s a good attitude. As we wrap up, what’s down the pike for you, anything you want to tease?

Hillary Hanak: Yeah. I’m filming a web series in New York this June. I’m doing 3 out of the 6 episodes, and it’s called Halfway to Fifty. Kelly Murray is directing one of the episodes as well, we work well together and often. We just went up to Jim Thorpe Film Festival for our film, Your Wreckless Heart, which screened in the Local Heroes film block. It was also accepted to the Philadelphia Independent Film Festival.

Kelly Murray And Hillary Hanak — Kelly Murray and Hillary Hanak

Kris Mendoza: You’re doing all this under the banner of Pink Lemonade Pictures?

Hillary Hanak: Yeah.

Kris Mendoza: Gotcha. Care to talk about Pink Lemonade Pictures and the kind of work you guys do?

Hillary Hanak: Sure. So Kelly and I met years ago through mutual film friends. She had written a script for a short film called The Astronomer and contacted me to shoot it. And our friendship and working relationship kind of blossomed from there. Under Pink Lemonade Pictures, we’re interested in making original films and documentaries that can impact and inspire our community. We’ve done three shorts: The Astronomer, 3:13 which is with Maestro’s Long Story Shorts platform, and Your Wreckless Heart. The Openers will be the first feature length project that we produce together.

313 Artwork — 3:13 – A Maestro Filmworks’ Long Story Short

Kris Mendoza: And you’ve got a nine to five!

Hillary Hanak: Yeah. I don’t sleep.

Kris Mendoza: Any parting thoughts?

Hillary Hanak: I think it’s a very tight knit community here in Philadelphia. I hope that through Project Forte, people can be exposed to more options for crew on their next job. I think it’s great what you guys are doing with this. I really do.

Kris Mendoza: That’s the hope! I really appreciate your time. Thanks again for joining us and look forward to working with you again!

Project Forte: Steve Nguyen

April 23, 2021

by Patrick COMMERCIAL Community People Project Forte Social Social Responsibility

Project Forte is an original series of interviews presented by Maestro Filmworks and hosted by Executive Producer, Kris Mendoza. These conversations work to amplify marginalized voices within our industry, promoting a continued initiative around allyship. Allyship is not about the struggles of our contemporaries canceling each other out, but rather about solidarity. Our goal is to cut through the noise of the status quo in order to highlight the voices of the many talented and creative individuals who are forces in their own craft.

This week we sit down with Steve Nguyen (he/him), a production manager and line producer working in Philadelphia. He investigates a crucial factor present in our industry, the difficulty of cutting through a cyclical network to establish roots and make more diverse connections. Steve shares a unique perspective, recognizing at a young age the social behaviors that cement cultural stereotypes and the importance of rising above them. Having fought for breakout opportunities, he recognizes the value of hands-on experience and has harvested a valuable education by cutting through the gravel of PA-work to achieve his goals in leadership. Join us in this deep dive, which broadens our understanding of how the industry can evolve, especially through considerate production staffing and management by Steve Nguyen.

Written and Edited by Kate Feher

_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Steve Nguyen: My name is Steve Nguyen and I’m Vietnamese and partly Chinese. In the film industry, I’ve been a production manager and a line producer as of late.

Kris Mendoza: Welcome. I know you’re about that Philly life but I actually don’t know too much about prior to that. Are you Philly born and raised?

Steve Nguyen: No, I was born in Lansdale, Pennsylvania and I really grew up in Souderton, Pennsylvania, and now live in Philadelphia. I went to Pennridge High School out in Perkasie. It was mainly a white school, there were maybe three Asian people..three black people.. and three Puerto Ricans out of about 500/600 people. It was a small school.

Actually, oddly, it felt like other Asians growing up were battling each other to be the token Asian person… which is a trap I didn’t fall into.

Kris Mendoza: It’s interesting you say that. This has nothing to do with filmmaking but … If I’m out with a couple of Filipino guy friends and we see another group of Filipino guys at the club: you would assume that we’re like, “Hey, what’s up my people.” [jokes] But you end up staring each other down and trying to be like that, “Hey, there’s only enough room here for one Filipino group.” So it becomes very territorial. I’ve tried to change that up a little bit by walking up and introducing myself but people are still so put off by that.

Steve Nguyen: Yeah, I think once you go to college you start opening up, but a decent amount of Asians grow up being the “only ones” and there is a sense of survival pushing you to vibe with the white person, even in relationships. I just remember the Asian kids would make such self-deprecating comments about being Asian, like, “Oh look at my eyes.” And I would see all the white guys laugh or play on a stereotype and that would anger me. But at the time I thought, “Well, they’re also winning. That kid is winning because people are liking that shit.”

Kris Mendoza: Like he’s owning it.

Screen Shot 2021 04 23 At 11.33.14 AM — Steve Nguyen and Jo Shen on the set of Americano

Steve Nguyen: Yeah, and I think sometimes black people fall into that too, especially in high school. They use the stereotype to gain more of that status and acceptance. It’s very hard to be yourself as any color but, still, they use that device to make themselves look less alien to people. I think it still goes on a little bit as adults, especially in corporate culture, but not so much in the art industry because it’s too evolved for that.

Kris Mendoza: …You talk differently, you carry yourself differently just to fit in more?

Steve Nguyen: Yeah, and then you might make a joke to put someone at ease about your culture. If the Asian guy brings lunch for the office, he might joke, “Don’t worry, it’s not dog.” People laugh, which relieves tension, and maybe you feel better but I don’t support that.

Kris Mendoza: Injecting humor to disarm because you feel like you have to be liked or accepted?

Steve Nguyen: You do it to yourself first, too. If you brought in Kimchi and somebody asks about it, you sort of dismiss it with, “Here’s some shit that I eat.” Almost to defend against an ignorant person who might say something ridiculous. I don’t know if we’re off on a tangent but-

Kris Mendoza: No, this is right on schedule here. You said this doesn’t happen in our industry because it’s too evolved, is that because filmmakers tend to be more progressive in general?

Steve Nguyen: It’s because I think we’ve been conditioned. If you’re in the film business, you’ve obviously watched movies, TV, or subscribed to something like music so generally, it becomes the diet of what we consume.. You’re watching more, and you’re probably exploring more, so you have that open mind. Culturally, whether it’s race, whether it’s sexuality… you’ve been exposed to it more than the average person. Also the documentaries for the past 15, 20 years have been very social justice conscious so I think people are hyper-aware of political, racial, gender, and environmental issues.

So, yes, I think that’s why most people in our industry are overly evolved. We’re just constantly learning things or open to learning things.

Kris Mendoza: It’s refreshing to hear that because, of the people I’ve spoken to so far, there really are different perspectives on how far the industry has come and how much further it has to go. I’m trying to gauge it properly. Is there a lack of people to nominate or is there work getting lost in the sea of the status quo? Is it possible there are not nearly enough people entering this industry because of cultural differences or expected career paths?

Steve Nguyen: I don’t think the establishment is a systemic thing. I think socially, filmmakers are aware and they are trying to be a “good person” when it comes to the practice.

In the end I think it’s who you know or who that person knows. Networking in any industry presents a barrier to entry, made more difficult unless you shine. It’s not necessarily about race, but it is mainly a white industry still. Black people have been successful but until there’s an active hiring initiative for somebody with a different culture or background or race, hiring starts with “Oh, I need to fill in this position, who do you know?” So most likely that person doesn’t target a minority option they just say, “Oh my cousin or my friend from college does this…”

So you can call that systemic but I don’t think anyone is saying, “I only hire white people.” Look at how politicians tend to fall up. They keep failing and failing but they’re getting promoted all the time and I think it’s the same way with this industry. We could take chances on untried people and get rid of bad people. Stop giving them more opportunities. We wouldn’t have someone like Spike Lee otherwise, but it’s not even much of a gamble. You can vet them, interview them, put them through the wringer, but give them an opportunity.

I think you have to build your own economy, that’s what Atlanta did. They have lots of minority-owned businesses and the method is to keep working with each other, even on an individual basis. There’s reciprocation in building alliances but we can’t get there because everybody’s chasing after the big dogs.

There’s a big movement to decentralize power and I think we can have multiple economies. It doesn’t have to be one linear economy. And it’s moving that way anyway. We don’t even have a common mainstream anymore. Everybody operates in their own cultural world now.

Kris Mendoza: Yes, absolutely. So, you said a lot of good things there and what I’m hearing is – you have to take a chance on folks but there’s no shortage, it’s just a matter of hiring. When staffing a production line, instead of going with the people that have been at arms length, take a second to ask, “Who else is out there?” Ask a couple of questions, get a little more intel, but open up your horizons in terms of finding new people.

Steve Nguyen: Yeah, personally for me, that’s why I think I’ve taken so long to get where I’m at today. I didn’t come into this with a connection. I had to put in the free work or the low-pay work and grind. Nothing is given to you unless you know somebody. We all want diversity but we also want the people that will work hard, rather than placing people due to a quota. I’ve always had a mindset for hiring diversely, but a big complication is the timetable. I can’t spend a month looking for the right candidate who may also be female or a person of color when –

Kris Mendoza: – when you know five white dude gaffers, for example?

Steve Nguyen: We try, right?

Kris Mendoza: I’m interested to hear how you cut your teeth in the industry, was there anyone or two people in particular who took a chance on you? And what was that experience like?

Steve Nguyen: Yeah, so there was a film program available while I was in college. I was a business major but I took this 10-week class in Philly – a bit like what the New York Film Academy does. There was a producing teacher who also worked as an independent movie producer and he said, “Hey, we’re shooting a movie, you want to come and help?”

So I would work, then go to class, and at night I would volunteer on those shoots. Eventually, I was making enough money to leave my other job and commit to building my resume. I got a lot of experience on low-paying jobs and I was expanding outward towards Baltimore and New York, taking any job I could. Starting with PA work, I shifted to grip and then to AD then UPM, which was just a natural progression for me since I had a business background. Making a movie is more than just the story. It’s the financing and the distribution. That’s the next chapter for me.

Kris Mendoza: You put in a lot of sweat equity to get where you are today and in some cases, this loops back to what you said earlier, you’re starting with no real connections. Whether you’re a person of color or not, you have to grind a little bit harder and jump in with a weighted vest from the beginning.

Steve Nguyen: It’s either comfortable or very lucky. I could not get a PA job on a studio picture so I had to be in the independent world. You have to know someone to get in on these Hollywood productions and if you’re a good worker, then you’re part of the machine. Ironically, I think it was better to learn at that bottom level. Instead of waiting around to get that production manager opportunity in the Hollywood system, you can grow the position you want. Being in the freelance world, you’re an entrepreneur without the business behind you. You’re trying to sell yourself and you can always build towards whatever position you want to be in.

Kris Mendoza: I 100% agree with you. I’m also conflicted because I’ve had multiple conversations with other folks about these diversity quotas and in some cases it’s a modern-day affirmative action in our industry presenting those necessary opportunities. Is it fair to say there will be undue pressure for people of color fulfilling those quotas to prove themselves for the whole of a marginalized community? Will they have to try extra hard to impress people as a responsibility? Is it down to the few, to prove we can operate and we can do well in these positions if given the opportunity?

Steve Nguyen: Yeah, in the end, everything’s competition so you have to be better than – doesn’t even matter what race – you need to be better than everyone or you’ll be replaced. There’s a problem when the people in power take the initiative to hire an assistant of color or a woman assistant but then they don’t extend that to any position of managerial or department head status. If the department head is white, do we feel good enough that the lower-paying job is diverse? The true progressive should involve seeing the potential in a person and grooming them to be the best they can be.

Kris Mendoza: So if it’s just a checkbox, then there’s the possibility that it’s considered “good enough” …

Steve Nguyen: Hollywood’s been talking about diversity forever and I don’t see a change. The only way to really do this is out-compete them as companies and give out opportunities that way. When they see a certain model for inclusion working, maybe then those minority companies can breakthrough.

I don’t think it’s deliberately systemic, but you need to build your system instead of waiting on somebody to do it. You can try 25% harder to give that opportunity, and honestly that’s all I can ask for. Just try a little bit but don’t kill yourself doing it, you know? Because you might want more Indian people on your set, but you’re in Nashville …

Kris Mendoza: So let me take it a step farther and say, assuming we do that extra 25% and you go that extra mile, what does this net production? What is the value for productions to have this kind of diversity at the end of the day anyway? Beyond inclusivity, what results can we quantify?

Screen Shot 2021 04 23 At 9.56.03 AM — Behind the Scenes with Steven Nguyen

Steve Nguyen: I don’t know if it’s a measurable thing. I don’t know if you can make more money because of it. I think socially it’s good to talk to people that don’t look like you, or work with people that don’t look like you. I think it helps with bridging communities in general and if you’re forcing it, sure maybe that could make things worse. If you hire a bunch of Filipino janitors to satisfy a diversity quota but don’t place any as managers, that’s where it gets bad socially.

Kris Mendoza: That’s when they’ve really missed the point.

Steve Nguyen: I think maybe you can quantify how it affects the well-being of a team or a process. People can feel good about it, which probably makes them better at working. Because they also check their boxes – “I went to work today and I talked to black guy, I talked to a woman, I talked to an Asian guy.” It’s that subconscious feeling that trickles out into society.

Even though in today’s society we’re getting into a person’s identity, we’re also hoping that when people talk to each other, it’s not about the identity or maybe you don’t see their identity. Ultimately you want to be so comfortable with them that you don’t see their color or gender, etc. We want to talk to each other as humans and to get there you have to exercise your biases or prejudices. If you’re not comfortable around women, talk to women all day and become culturally socialized.

Kris Mendoza: Yeah, maybe you can’t say a film made 10% more because you got X number of POC or anything like that. But maybe there’s a way to gauge the economic impact of a film within a city. You can gather the production details of how much money you spent in restaurants and hotels, etc.

I do agree, being on set with other cultures breaks down those barriers which keep you from people you wouldn’t normally interact with. If you’re able to collaborate, you take those relationships with you, even beyond work, broadening all your horizons – I think that absolutely makes sense.

Interestingly, you talk about the issue behind not putting people of color in managerial positions but just including them as seconds and thirds… I think that’s especially important when it comes to a narrative. If you get a Director, a DP, or a Production Designer in charge of molding things visually, that affects the level of authenticity and the nuances of telling a diverse story.

Steve Nguyen: Guiding or mentoring a person who goes on to have a successful life because of that opportunity, that can come back to you 10 fold.

Going back to the business side of things, we’re talking about diversity in hiring, but the diversity in product identity is also important. There are a lot of films and TV shows that market without a cultural identifier, so that becomes a white story. Especially the blockbusters or any big movies, so you have to find a charming person. There are certain actors like Denzel Washington or Will Smith who sort of go beyond race – they’re just personable.

Kris Mendoza: Yeah I think it important to talk about diversity in front of and behind the camera. I think when you start to balance on both sides, that’s when you really start to build these new economies, like you’re saying.

Steve Nguyen: Also, you’re an entrepreneur, so you’ll understand that Hollywood tests independent films. They let you risk your own money to make these decisions and then if they see that it’s successful, they bring it to market. Take Ryan Coogler for instance – he did a $300,000 movie and he put his money where his mouth is. Maybe that is why he got the chance to do Creed then Black Panther.

Things are happening now, Eddie Huang did a movie recently called Boogie, it’s an Asian basketball story. Think those stories are pretty cool to watch but also I’d like to see stories where race has nothing to do with it.

Kris Mendoza: …where there just happen to be Asian folks doing regular people things and it’s not a focal point.

Steve Nguyen: Yeah, how many stories have we seen about infidelity or “the affair” and I think “Why is that a white specific story?” Or all these lifetime movies about women in peril – they’re not culturally specific so you really could put any charming person of color into it. You could use that same formula for anybody.

Kris Mendoza: I think audiences are primed now. I remember in 2000, Romeo Must Die came out with Jet Li and Aaliyah. [ R.I.P. Aaliyah ] I read there was actually a kissing scene at the end of the movie and test audiences freaked out.

Steve Nguyen: They ended up hugging in the end, right?

Kris Mendoza: They shoulder bumped or hugged or something like that but apparently there was actually a more romantic scene in there and audiences just weren’t ready. People were up in arms then, but today, I think we have to make the content and hold ourselves accountable, make good stuff, and not rely on race as a ticket.

Steve Nguyen: But also it’s like, “Who cares?” Even with this cancel-culture, I still hear the same voices over and over. I think any emotion is good so you have to walk away from that critique, especially in the creative world…there’s always going to be somebody that doesn’t like what you made so just stand by it. I don’t even know why they use a test market. Imagine writing a song that is test-marketed. You want to have some emotion to it, that’s how you get people to be passionate about it-

Kris Mendoza: Why create if you’re only making what people think they want…

Screen Shot 2021 04 23 At 11.33.22 AM — Steve Nguyen and Time Viola on the set of Americano

Steve Nguyen: Yeah, and you shouldn’t market in a general sense. I hope if you are going to a test market, it’s with people that already like that genre. If it’s a superhero movie, don’t test market to people who don’t like superhero movies. If they’d rather watch Italian neo-realism films, then who cares about their input. It’s not for them.

Kris Mendoza: This has been an insightful conversation, do you have any parting thoughts?

Steve Nguyen: Be open to learn, evolve and commit to the destiny that you define. Use your voice, someone will listen.